Why Modern Athletes Must Be Creators: Lessons from Max Fleming and the Savannah Bananas

Technically Creative by KoobrikLabs Podcast Transcript

Title: Why Modern Athletes Must Be Creators: Lessons from Max Fleming and the Savannah Bananas

Orlando (00:00)
Whatever image you conjuring your head when you think of a sports
manager, I’m pretty sure it’s going to look a lot like Jerry Maguire,
but that’s probably not in line with how the job actually exists in
the age of TikTok, name image likeness deals. And at a time when a
team like the Savannah bananas, for example, are selling out Fenway
park. My guest today, Max Fleming is part of a new breed of manager
working with a new breed of talent as founder of motive LA. He’s at
the crossroads of sports, entertainment, and digital culture.
helping viral athletes and creators turn their moment in the spotlight
into long-term opportunity. Max actually manages most of the Savannah
Bananas, and if you don’t know who they are, they’re technically just
a college summer league team, yet they’re selling out MLB stadiums.
That’s impressive even for pro teams. And it’s not just great for
baseball, it’s transformative for the players, because instead of
toiling away in obscurity, they now have a viral platform to build
their digital presence and capitalize on that attention.
Max is the guy helping them turn those viral moments into real
careers. And he approaches it less like an agent, more like a
teammate. His mantra is simple, community, consistency, relatability.
And his sense of responsibility to the people he manages is clear.
He’s there to protect them from burnout, help them fight through the
imposter syndrome, and build careers that lack decades, not months.
But here’s what’s new. Thanks to social media and NIL, younger
athletes no longer have to struggle in obscurity or bed for scraps of
cash
while they wait for a professional contract, it gives them something
real in that gap between college and the pros. With somebody like Max
in their corner, they can build a following, shape a voice, and give
themselves something real to trade on long before they ever step onto
a major league team’s roster. So this is the story of what modern
management looks like. And I’m sure it’s not what you think. So please
stick around.
Max Fleming. I’m so excited to have you on the podcast. You are the
founder and CEO of motive LA motive. LA seems almost a misnomer
because it seems like you are national to be sure. Um, yeah, I’m
really excited to have you on because, know, you sit at the
intersection of both management and sports and you you manage talent,
you know, sort of online and viral talent and you’re growing very
fast.
And I’m just fascinated to hear more about what you do, because I
think it’s a very specific niche and it’s growing so fast. think, you
know, congratulations. I’ll start with that.
Speaker 1 (02:31)

Thank you. I appreciate it. A little bit about what we’re cooking up
and what we’re doing is, listen, man, we want to, at the core of it,
we’re having fun. You know what mean? We’re at the intersection of
sports and entertainment from a digital standpoint. Yes, we want to
hit those real viral and free virality through the notes and the
relatable content and consistent content that our creators make. But
at end of the day, Motive’s mission is to be 2025’s version of sports
marketing.
And how we’re doing so is being great one thing before we’re great at
another thing. And our specific category is, really, we represent the
best and brightest creators from a relatability standpoint and an
entertainment standpoint that touches all notes across many different
sports and varieties. And listen, man, we, we, we, are growing day in
and day out. We’ve been in business for 17 months now, and hopefully
we make it to 18 months. I think we will, but I don’t know about 19.
No, I’m joking or kicking ass. But I would say everything is, is, has
been amazing. And it’s a testament to the talent that we work with.
You know, it’s very much our business is operated on quality over
quantity and specific unique individuals from a very specific
standpoint of who we work with. And that’s been the testing into our
business. time.
Speaker 2 (03:45)
Yeah, I want to get into the specifics of the people that you work
with, because I think it’s a, it’s really interesting. know, you guys
are at the intersection of sort of sports culture and media. think
everybody is a sort of multi hyphenate now. You know, I mean, anybody
who’s, know, you work with a lot of athletes, you work with a lot of
the Savannah bananas, which is an incredibly awesome viral, you know,
kind of team, a real experience for everybody who goes, they are one
of the most watched teams in sports now. I mean, which is incredible.
But I think that like, what I really like to ask kind of first is, you
explain what a manager is first for people who don’t really kind of
have a context for that? And then more specifically how you’ve changed
it. Cause watching what you do, I feel like you’re not a regular
sports manager. You’re not a regular entertainment manager. You guys
kind of really get in the weeds on.
on crafting people’s online presence in such a way that you’re
maximizing their brand value beyond the sports. So I’d just love to
get your, your, overview on those two things.
Speaker 1 (04:47)
You said a best for me right there. That’s it. mean, it’s just like,
listen, manager is a broad word. You know what I mean? There’s,
there’s, there’s it’s, it’s, and it’s a broad job. It’s a job where
you have to wear 75 different hats all at once in success for your
client’s career. And listen, how, we kind of approach it is from a
teammate standpoint. I’ll always call myself, whether you call me an
agent, a manager or a representative or this out of the other thing.
Yes, I run a management company, but we are, and we always will be the
teammate.

You said a best for me right there. That’s it. mean, it’s just like,
listen, manager is a broad word. You know what I mean? There’s,
there’s, there’s it’s, it’s, and it’s a broad job. It’s a job where
you have to wear 75 different hats all at once in success for your
client’s career. And listen, how, we kind of approach it is from a
teammate standpoint. I’ll always call myself, whether you call me an
agent, a manager or a representative or this out of the other thing.
Yes, I run a management company, but we are, and we always will be the
teammate.
to those that we have the privilege of working with from a business
standpoint. And for example, all of our clients, we are teammates
tried and true having their back when deals don’t go their way. And
when deals do go their way, yes, we have to find new work and build
their brand and really surround themselves with the right buyers and
peers that will improve their career over time. But at the end of the
day, it’s a rewarding job when you allow yourself to be on a TEAM
team.
And amongst each individual client that we work with, the goal is to
win at the end of the day. You know what I mean? It’s if we’re going
to play in sports, we’re going to play in that arena. We got to
operate like a team environment so that everyone feels great. And as a
management standpoint is a lot of these, for example, a lot of our
clients, yes, they play for the Savannah bananas or they played for a
team prior, or they are in a, you know, collective group. We’re the
coach for the name on the back of the Jersey. They already have
coaches from the name on the front of the Jersey.
It’s our job to build a career over 30 plus years with them as the
teammate in the weeds for that individual person.
Speaker 2 (06:22)
Yeah. mean, and so how does that work? You know, cause I mean, I think
of a traditional manager as, mean, a, or you, you’re always a jack of
all trades, but obviously the, the role of a traditional manager is
more figuring out kind of what to do next and who to set that, you
know, athlete up with in terms of the next move in their career. Then
you often act as a bit of a business manager as well. But you seem to
be kind of also taking that step of, ⁓
of curating ⁓ their social media and the approaches that they might
take with their personal brand in social. Like you did it with the
Poynter Brothers, you’re doing it with Jackson Olsen and many other
members of the Savannah Bananas. And that seems like a natural fit
because obviously they’re already so social media oriented. is that,
are we witnessing in you the new
era of manager or is that still a USP you have over others?
Speaker 1 (07:23)
I would say I’ve learned from others on my previous places. I’ve
worked before founding motive. I would say is I learned how to adapt
and kind of change my management style. One thing that I learned very
well was I worked for a company called Buckwall that has been around
for 50 plus years and built a business off of Howard Stern. that is
traditional agenting and traditional representation. So not only did I
kind of learn the education of how to do this in a way that’s been
done for 50 years.

I would say I’ve learned from others on my previous places. I’ve
worked before founding motive. I would say is I learned how to adapt
and kind of change my management style. One thing that I learned very
well was I worked for a company called Buckwall that has been around
for 50 plus years and built a business off of Howard Stern. that is
traditional agenting and traditional representation. So not only did I
kind of learn the education of how to do this in a way that’s been
done for 50 years.
But I also learned how to do this in a way that has been done only for
a few years since the creator economy started, you know, spiking when
I spent some time at underscore talent. I kind of took the mold from
the both of those shops to create what my management style is now. I
will always fight for our clients, like any agent or representative
has in the last 50 plus years and how this kind of Hollywood mantra
has unfolded.
But the new media and the new mediums that we play in that are so like
exciting, it feels like Hollywood and like the forties and fifties,
man, where it was really taking hold is the creator economy. And when
I say we want to be really great at one thing before we’re good at
another is we want to own the category that is that sports and
entertainment crossover. So we’ve been so specific about who we work
with and testament to one of my best buds in the whole world. And it
is Jackson who I’ve represented for.
Got five, six years now. He’s now a groomsman in my wedding, which I’m
stoked about.
He joined a team that really kind of came to fame of bringing the
entertainment to a sport that God they’re trying to do everything in
their power to make more entertaining. So what we want to do at our
core from all the clients that we work with and what we do as a
business, not only for the talent we rep, but also the brands we
consult with and also the ventures that we participate in is how do we
make sports fun? And how do we make sports fun through a lens that is
on your small screen, not on your silver screen yet.
But making sports fun through a, those viral moments that you see as
you’re scrolling, TikTok and Instagram, whether you’re in bed or
you’re, you know, picking some time off is we want to be those moments
that fill your day with fun while also getting the feeling that you’re
still watching a game on Sunday-esque type feeling. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:38)
Yeah.
And, and do you find that that, you know, being able to sort of have
that route to being a creator, the ability to build one’s own brand,
do you find that that gives you leverage in the traditional
conversations of, know, when you’re talking to somebody about, know,
their, their position on their team or potentially going somewhere
else or whatever else, are you finding that the two are, are working
hand in hand or is, or is being a creator more of a sort of backup
plan for what’s happening after a sport?

And, and do you find that that, you know, being able to sort of have
that route to being a creator, the ability to build one’s own brand,
do you find that that gives you leverage in the traditional
conversations of, know, when you’re talking to somebody about, know,
their, their position on their team or potentially going somewhere
else or whatever else, are you finding that the two are, are working
hand in hand or is, or is being a creator more of a sort of backup
plan for what’s happening after a sport?
Speaker 1 (10:08)
So we, we represent and like, listen, yes, we represent some
professional athletes and a majority of our businesses, the best and
brightest creators that play in sports. So I would say those talent
that yes, are the new age athlete that you have to have a social
presence if you want to earn NIL dollars. And then NIL deal at the end
of the day is is is marketing and endorsement deal. But now the
distribution of that marketing and endorsement deal is through social
channels.
It’s all a digital billboard that’s created on Instagram and TikTok,
Snapchat, Facebook, YouTube shorts, wherever that content is going to
be distributed. And those are where those like, for example, I talk
with Red Bull every single day for a month, a bunch of our clients,
and they’re really making a significant effort on getting into NIL.
They just signed probably the biggest name in college football, which
is Arch Manning. And this is the first time they’re competing against
the Pepsi co’s and the Cokes, the Gatorades of the world.
And now Red Bull’s entering into that, they only want to hire the
talent that has the best and brightest engaging social channels. Why?
They never need to spend another dollar on any type of traditional
advertising again. And they can really dollar to metric basis. They
know exactly how they’re spending their money and exactly who’s
entertaining and engaging with it while also casting a wide net. So
that gives, that gives arch leverage.
But I would still say the coaches that are coaching him at Texas
Longhorns, they want him to be the traditional football player. think
it only gives him leverage off the field, not leverage on the field
because of the tides still being the old guard versus the new guard in
sport.
Speaker 2 (11:47)
example, a, a, athlete comes to you and says, you know, I’m starting
to get a little bit of traction here and whatever else, but man, I’ve
never done anything online. I’ve never built a social presence or
whatever else. What, what do you, you know, is the first step to just
get them out of that mindset and just kind of push them into
something, anything, or at least trying and experimenting, or do you
still kind of, or do you take the view that like actually, you know,
go, go for it, keep doing what you’re doing. Don’t worry about that.
Or is, is it an
absolutely required part of, you know, of the experience as a modern
athlete to have that social channel really pop in.

Speaker 1 (12:24)
So great question. think the experience of a modern athlete also comes
with the experience of if you’re playing your sport at the highest
level, you’re automatically going to carry an Instagram or a TikTok
following. Why? Because if I’m watching X player on the court, Monday,
Wednesday, Friday, whenever he or she’s game is, and I really like the
performance on that court, I’m going to go find you on Instagram and
I’m going to go press that follow button. But from an engagement
standpoint, their job is to play
basketball for that team. The coaching that we would bring to the
table is yes, we want that that to be 100 % of your priority. But if
you find the extra time off the court, we need to build a business for
a 30 to 40 year career. You’re not going to be playing basketball for
that long. What we can do now is set the ground rule. If we can fight
through the imposter syndrome, because I have the imposter syndrome,
getting onto socials and actually creating content that
You know, your friends approve of or your community approves of or
that doesn’t feel cringy or there’s this stigma behind it. Fighting
through it in a really creative and reactive manner. Dude, all of a
sudden you are generating income in a multitude of different facets.
Why? Because if not only if you can play basketball at the highest
level, you’re going to entertain endorsement partners. But if you have
the knack and the ability to distribute engaging content that has
nothing to do with you on the court.
all the other brand partners that you could expose yourself to from a
financial standpoint, we’ll come and entertain with you. And then all
of a sudden, when that day ends that he or she is ready to stop
playing basketball, now you can turn into a full blown media business
where you can integrate podcasts and you can integrate more social
content. You can integrate all these different types of intervals that
will drive not only ad revenue, but platform revenue. And then reverse
engineering the traditional Hollywood.
studio system is we actually took advantage of the platform we had
from a sports standpoint, built it on socials, created our own media
and mediums. And now let’s take all that IP to the traditional
Hollywood studios and get a vetting process with those networks and
studios that can help bolster us as individuals. And you see all the
major athletes doing it now, but if we can get started high school,
college now, it’s a recipe for success more often than not.
Speaker 2 (14:50)
Yeah, I mean, that’s interesting. So you’re basically saying it’s not
up to you anymore. You’re doing a sport that’s public enough. Somebody
is going to be posting what you just did, you know, in on the court
or, you know, or on the diamond. And, you know, like in there probably
getting follows anyway, whether or not they’re activating, they have
some sort of social media presence.

Yeah, I mean, that’s interesting. So you’re basically saying it’s not
up to you anymore. You’re doing a sport that’s public enough. Somebody
is going to be posting what you just did, you know, in on the court
or, you know, or on the diamond. And, you know, like in there probably
getting follows anyway, whether or not they’re activating, they have
some sort of social media presence.
the, you know, you feel like, you know, harnessing it at least and
channeling it to make sure that it’s part of the ongoing conversation
is an important part of what they’re doing, even at an early age.
Speaker 1 (15:22)
And the discussion is, is, okay, you’re going to play that sport and
somebody’s actually going to create content and monetize off you. it
going to be you monetizing it and the person that hires you to play
that sport? Or is it only going to be the company that’s hiring you?
And I would say, Orlando, I would say like, number one thing is you’d
got, you to want to build the business off the court. And I can’t ever
say that every athlete or every person.
Like if you, if you want to be the best point guard to ever live, you
got to go all in on basketball, but at the same time, we want to be
the team around you to help compliment that business so that you have
that one track focus on as your sport, but we can also prepare you for
your future by creating new media over time from a traditional and
holistic standpoint and be that TAM team that you can rely on knowing
that it’s actually being executed off the court.
Speaker 2 (16:15)
Yeah. Yeah. Cause I think that like, listen, think that, you know,
Jackson Orland and you know, as, Olson is a really good example. mean,
especially because sort of moving into the Savannah bananas, the
Savannah bananas have, undeniably a crack baseball, which is
phenomenal. mean, nobody has done anything new in baseball for a
hundred years. And what they’ve done is they’ve made it such an event.
They’re sold out everywhere they go. They are, you know, they’re fun.
They’re a reverent.
They’ve really gotten their socials in order. mean, I can imagine that
being an athlete on that team, you you can’t just be a quiet
participant.
Speaker 1 (16:53)
You can’t, it’s a, it’s a requirement. Yeah, for sure. I would say
it’s like the one thing that the owner, Jesse has done so well is, is,
you know, he set ground rules. Like if you want to play on this
baseball team, you need to abide by what we’re going to try to do from
putting the fan first before the game and knowing that reverses and
reverse and engineers the process in which it’s played. So it’s all
about the entertainment. Listen.
Aaron Judge’s one job is to play for the Yankees at his highest
ability to win World Series. That is it. Jackson Olsen’s job is to
play really, really competitive baseball. They’re throwing 95 plus on
that field, but at the same time, build a brand, build an audience,
sign 2000 autographs after every single game. And Jackson played
traditional baseball, man. He was playing, he played ball at
University of Hartford. That’s where we met. And then he played.

Aaron Judge’s one job is to play for the Yankees at his highest
ability to win World Series. That is it. Jackson Olsen’s job is to
play really, really competitive baseball. They’re throwing 95 plus on
that field, but at the same time, build a brand, build an audience,
sign 2000 autographs after every single game. And Jackson played
traditional baseball, man. He was playing, he played ball at
University of Hartford. That’s where we met. And then he played.
D one down in Stetson and he thought he was going to go to the league.
had a little deal with the diamond backs. was his, his original, you
know, mantra. He started making tick-tock content because it was a
means to create a creative outlet for him. And sometimes, sometimes he
can be a little reserved and shy and in, in person when you’re first
getting to meet him. But boy is he pronounced and personable when he’s
on the baseball field. And when he’s on.
the social platform because that’s his means to express himself. And
one thing that for sure he’s a, he’s a handsome dude, man. Yeah, no
doubt, no doubt. He’s got that hair. He’s got the, he’s got the, the,
the blonde tits, man.
Speaker 2 (18:30)
The hair is quite special.
Speaker 1 (18:32)
The hair is amazing. my God. But he’s leaned into it. He’d gone all in
and he’s in a, he’s in, he’s in a system and a platform that allows
him to do so. ⁓ one thing that I got to say about my boy Jackson, man
is no, he’ll say no to any deal that comes his way. If it doesn’t make
sense for him and his brand for the future. And he is so specific. And
I think I learn from him every day, man. He, he, he, yes, there’s a
lot of money that he leaves on the table, but he knows that the money
will continue to grow if he makes the right choices.
as his career unfolds and we can never really tell what the right
choice is, but he always goes based on his gut feeling and it’s been
working for him in the last six years. He’s grown immensely and he’s
kicking ass. He’s amazing.
Speaker 2 (19:12)
Yeah,
absolutely. And to anybody who doesn’t know who the Savannah bananas
are. mean, I think you’d have to be living under a rock or, maybe just
somebody who’s not that into sports, but the Savannah bananas are, are
a. I would be right in saying minor league baseball team that is, that
has just been doing these incredible shows. I mean, it’s, you know,
the whole baseball game is a show. The fans are interacting. They’ve
got lots of different sort of things. They’re, they’re very.
It’s very, very viral. It’s hard to not see them online. I mean, I see
them on TikTok all the time and they’re just great. It makes you want
to go to a baseball game, even if you’re not a baseball fan.
Speaker 1 (19:53)

Speaker 1 (19:53)
And it’s just stay in the park, man. It’s something that’s super
entertaining and it’s family and fam first and whether you like
baseball or not, it’s a great excuse and experience to get out of the
house and go try and do something fun. The hardest part is they’re
doing so well that there’s like 6 million people on a ticket wait
list. So if you get tickets, really, it’s an awesome experience.
Speaker 2 (20:14)
But I mean, and that’s a tremendous thing. mean, because, you know,
smaller baseball fields were not booking tickets and like they were,
you know, very much, I mean, the Savannah bananas have been really
helping that level of baseball kind of stay afloat. I mean, it’s just
up until they came around, nobody was selling that many tickets. And,
know, in a lot of these parks, a lot of these smaller teams were at
risk of, of, you know, of closure.
And so they’ve done a lot of really good for the baseball industry in
general.
Speaker 1 (20:45)
1000 % in Orlando. Don’t hold me to this exact stat, but I know that I
read this somewhere. It was like last season when the bananas were
touring from Boston, I’m a diehard Red Sox fan. love those guys more
than ever. The last time they had sold out before this game last
season that the bananas played a Fenway. The last game they had sold
out was the 2018 wild card series. Last year was 2024. The Sabana
bananas were the first ones to sell out Fenway park. Now they’ve done
it four times since. It’s, it’s a recipe that
Not only does creating tick tock content work for driving ticket
sales, but they’re, they’re doing something right. And everybody needs
to kind of tune in and take a watch. It’s insane. They’re sure it is
immense.
Speaker 2 (21:24)
For sure. mean, pause this and go, go look at some of their content.
It’s really, I mean, it’s really fun. the owner and the CEO of it,
mean, dresses it only wears a big pink, a big yellow suit. And, know,
he’s committed. I mean, that dude is committed to the fucking call.
Speaker 1 (21:41)
I was like, God, he is, no doubt.
Speaker 2 (21:44)
You know, one of the other things I’d like to talk to you about is the
pointer brothers are another, you know, another group, you know, pair
that you’ve been managing. They are sort of sports oriented, they’re
not correct me if I’m wrong, but they’re not professional athletes.
But what you’ve done is you’ve curated their social media to such a
point that like now they’re definitely sort of sports personalities
online and they’ve built a sort of multimillion dollar brand.

You know, one of the other things I’d like to talk to you about is the
pointer brothers are another, you know, another group, you know, pair
that you’ve been managing. They are sort of sports oriented, they’re
not correct me if I’m wrong, but they’re not professional athletes.
But what you’ve done is you’ve curated their social media to such a
point that like now they’re definitely sort of sports personalities
online and they’ve built a sort of multimillion dollar brand.
You know, with a lot of the content that you’ve, you’ve been, you
know, a real part of helping them shape. Can you just explain to me
that? Cause that seems to me to be the flip side of that is that, you
know, obviously there’s traditional sports management with social
media tacked on. This is social media first personality with sports
kind of in the mix. Can you explain that and, and how you found them
and what you built there with them?
Speaker 1 (22:36)
Orlando, man, this is like, this is where our business is going. It’s,
what I’m get out of it. It’s what gets me out of bed every single day.
am literally obsessed with their business. Why? Because they are the,
they are the liaison or they’re the Trojan horse between sports at a
high level to the everyday consumer. And we reach it so specifically
and so perfectly. And listen, these guys, I would have to say Mike and
Henry are the Poynter brothers. Yes, I’ve, yes, I’ve been a
teammate to their business, but these guys want it so bad. We want to
work with clients that want it just as bad as we do. And they want to
succeed. come from the corporate America world. found fame as they
continue to create content through, through the pandemic and others
and, they stuck with it and their content started from making wedding
dance content and sports celebrations to now they’re there’s, know,
skit and scripted comedians that are reaching the.
Like an 85 % male audience between the ages of 18 to 35, their
engagement rate on social channels is north of 20 % on both channels.
And why? Because the goal through the content every single day is we
want to be your internet homies. We want to be your friends that is so
shareable that we can continue to drive shareability and share content
to everyone that you know. I would say, Orlando, when we go to like a
PGA Tour Tournament or we go to an NFL game or we go to an NBA game
and you’re walking through the stands with them, everyone and their
mother recognizes them. It’s just the power to how crazy the content
is working and the strategy behind the content over the last two and a
half years, we started working with them in September of 2023, I would
say has gone from what they were doing then to every time you create a
post, the thought process behind the activity of creating that post is
Would I share that to my best bud on any given day in the group chat?
And if we are able to kind of put that conscious feeling behind every
piece of content with notes of sports and notes of golf and notes of
all the sports that you and I can play every single day, it’s a recipe
for success. And over the last two years, not only have we hired us to
create social content for almost all the Olympic sports in Paris last
year, but now they’re, they’re creating con like they just appeared
in.

Would I share that to my best bud on any given day in the group chat?
And if we are able to kind of put that conscious feeling behind every
piece of content with notes of sports and notes of golf and notes of
all the sports that you and I can play every single day, it’s a recipe
for success. And over the last two years, not only have we hired us to
create social content for almost all the Olympic sports in Paris last
year, but now they’re, they’re creating con like they just appeared
in.
A humongous premier league commercial because they’re big fans of
soccer and it’s been, by the way, the number one performance on United
States rollout on social was their premier league commercial that
launched a week, a week ago because Mike and Henry have the knack and
ability to draw an audience and share it. And people want to see
their, their funny bits and their funny looking side eyes and all the
things that they make, but it’s all about consistency, community and
relatability. And they’ve won that audience. They’re the best.
Speaker 2 (25:30)
In terms of your strategy for coming out there, because as you say,
when you first interact with them, they were doing celebration videos.
Now they’ve really kind of found, it’s funny, was, I was going to
explain before you just explained it as you did, I was going to say
they found a sort of a tone of voice or whatever else, but you know,
that’s not tone of voice. That’s strategy of can I, or can I not share
this with my buddies in a, in a group chat? That’s a really tremendous
through line that.
from a creative direction standpoint makes you go, okay, we’re running
all of our concepting and ideation through this lens. And I think
that’s now hearing you say that it all makes all the sense in the
world. What does that look like when you’re first, right, when you’re
first engaging with them and they’re doing celebration videos, are you
just working through that and seeing what works and then finding that
strategy? Are you crafting that upfront and then implementing it? How?
How did you, how do you interact with them when you see them starting
out with something that’s very raw? What do you do to get them in this
place that they’re there now, you know, reliably outputting content
that feels not, not samey, but similar, you know, and repeatable and
successful.
Speaker 1 (26:42)
And I would say it’s no different than a manager that finds a actor or
actress that has a specific taste or genre that they play in. My taste
in my genre has been cultivated based on the people that I represent.
And I think it was all about, it was right place, right time. lot of
this, excuse my friends, a lot of this shit is right place, right
time. And it is, it is just the convenience of making sure that you
were in the mix at the right time in the right place. And I have to
shut up.
My, my client Jackson, Jackson introduced me to the pointer brothers.
were. He, the pointer brothers were going out of their comfort zone
one day and we’re shooting content with Jackson at the Savannah
bananas game. I ended up being there. This was September of 2023. I
had been following the guys for a long time. They’re from Boston. I’m
from Boston. So I’m always fed the Boston based creators. I would
watch and laugh and engage at their videos. We all just met. We hung
out quickly.

My, my client Jackson, Jackson introduced me to the pointer brothers.
were. He, the pointer brothers were going out of their comfort zone
one day and we’re shooting content with Jackson at the Savannah
bananas game. I ended up being there. This was September of 2023. I
had been following the guys for a long time. They’re from Boston. I’m
from Boston. So I’m always fed the Boston based creators. I would
watch and laugh and engage at their videos. We all just met. We hung
out quickly.
You know, then reached out to them and said, Hey guys, obsessed with
what you’re doing. Just want an opportunity to get a coffee with you
and kind of understand what the business looks like. They can, if we
can value and shape or form, would absolutely. Yeah. would say,
listen, man, it was right place, right time. And the reason behind
that is, is I recognized what they loved and what the potential was
where they were represented prior was an incredible place where they
were represented, but where we were able to bring value to their
business was.
the peers in which that we work with. They weren’t working with the
NBC sports of the world. They weren’t working with the, the, the
sports sponsorship and the sports companies that would actually drive
where their career was going to go. think the networks, the buyers in
the studios that we worked with to not only generate income for their
content, also they organically recognized we need to be leaning more
into this. need to be leaning more into that. Every time we struck a
brand partnership.
Every time we struck a hosting opportunity, every time we struck any
type of partnership opportunity for them, it was all about the sports
adjacent landscape and reaching the everyday consumer. And then we
just took a deep dive on analytics. We went in, we took, we use a
bunch of different softwares on our end to kind of get an
understanding of what their metrics and what their data looks like
from a performance standpoint and from an audience standpoint. And we
said, all right guys, you reach 85 % men majority in the United
States, some in the UK, some in the.
I’m in Australia. What do those people love? How do those people
react? And the number one consumer that brands are just trying to
reach are millennial men that spend a lot of money. And we found that,
we found that audience with them and that’s why it’s been working.
We’ve been able to sell to the right people in the right areas through
really fun and welcoming content. And that’s where we took it. Cause
we had the existing audience. We just had to fine tune the content so
that the buyers would react to us. And it was just progress over time.
Learn from what we know, but also try new trends and make it
repeatable. Because if we can repeat it, we can continue to grow.
Speaker 2 (29:45)
Yeah, you, you know, we were talking, we, had a chat a couple of weeks
ago and you were saying that, that, know, creativity isn’t just a
formula, it’s human insight, timing and voice. You’ve sort of just
explained that kind of, you know, there, when did you kind of realize
that that, you know, that, that it seems that you’re really balancing
the technological data with, you know, with human inspiration and
spark. that, is that a fair assessment?

Yeah, you, you know, we were talking, we, had a chat a couple of weeks
ago and you were saying that, that, know, creativity isn’t just a
formula, it’s human insight, timing and voice. You’ve sort of just
explained that kind of, you know, there, when did you kind of realize
that that, you know, that, that it seems that you’re really balancing
the technological data with, you know, with human inspiration and
spark. that, is that a fair assessment?
Speaker 1 (30:11)
You know, at the end of the day, the hardest part about what we do is,
we play in, in an industry where everybody forgets about the video you
posted yesterday. Everybody is waiting for the video you’re going to
post today. And then it’s going to just be a rinse and repeat cycle.
We just have to harness inspiration based on what is consistent, what
is driving community and what is relatable. I always say that it’s
like CCR. That’s like my, what I live in breathe by and kind of
harnessing.
current events and news and you know, the news cycle is so short and,
and being authentically and organically, you drives the content over
time. If you’re, if you’re acting and to be someone else, if you are
performing to be this, to do that, it’s not transferable and it’s not
a recipe for success. And I think the one thing Orlando that we say to
everybody and remember I have 2000 followers on Instagram and I know
all the people that follow me. So I’m saying this in a, in a facet
where
It’s from the clients that we represent and the data and the knowledge
that we’ve provided them is when you’re you, you’re the best version
of you. And you got to fill up your cup 10 times over filling up
anyone else’s. And we are always going to make sure that we’re going
to fight for you. So that would not only we can provide you with
creative ideas, but so that we can keep you moving because burnout can
get avoided when you have teams and voices in your head that can
motivate you further. And that’s the name for the business too.
We operate like youth football coaches. We’re going to make sure you
get 1 % every, 1 % better every single day. And I’ll call you Orlando
say I represented you, man. I’m you every day that the podcast is
going to keep growing and keep improving. And we’re going to keep
trying new questions and inspiration that we’re excited to talk and
create about. It’s just trying new things. And when we recognize that
that new thing works, it’s how do we make it?
work over time through a consistent cadence, not so much that we throw
everything at a wall and see what sticks is, it’s very strategic and
roll out.
Speaker 2 (32:10)
I’m really glad you brought up the human element of it, because it
seems like, you know, a lot of the people that you work with, they’re
all very young. You’re, you’re, you’re meeting and interact with them
young and, and preparing them for the future. you know, creators,
athletes are all rendered under a huge amount of pressure to perform
and to keep their mind right under intense scrutiny and under intense
pressure. Then as well, creators are under another intense pressure
where they’re constantly feeding an algorithm that never sleeps.

I’m really glad you brought up the human element of it, because it
seems like, you know, a lot of the people that you work with, they’re
all very young. You’re, you’re, you’re meeting and interact with them
young and, and preparing them for the future. you know, creators,
athletes are all rendered under a huge amount of pressure to perform
and to keep their mind right under intense scrutiny and under intense
pressure. Then as well, creators are under another intense pressure
where they’re constantly feeding an algorithm that never sleeps.
And there’s this sort of feeling that you constantly need to feed the
system. How do you help your clients avoid that burnout and stay
aligned with what kind of what actually matters?
Speaker 1 (32:49)
Listen, I don’t sell lamps. don’t sell pens. sell people for a living.
You know what I mean? And at the end of the day, we’re all just human
beings and we’re all just trying to do the best that we can. For
example, I have to run a business. I got to make sure the bills are
paid. I got to make sure that payroll is met. I got to make sure that
all my employees are feeling comfortable, safe so that they can
execute their work. That’s the stresses that I endure every day. And I
got to make sure that my clients are feeling great. I then take that
process of
What calms me down knowing that it’s going to be okay. And we’re going
to push through any stresses or nerves and then reciprocate that back
into the conversations with our clients. And those conversations are,
man, I don’t know what it’s like to have 20,000 people comment
something negative on your posts that you just created, but I do know
that I’m your, one of your best boys in the whole world. I know that
you can come to me to talk about anything in any shape or form and
that you’re going to post something again tomorrow that people are
going to love. And if they don’t screw it, I loved it.
And all that matters is that we, a team can continue to move forward
because at the end of the day, bad comments are still good engagement
when we’re trying to sell something. And then secondly, ⁓ it’s just
fighting through that constant imposter syndrome of if you have the
ability to create content in front of millions of people, you’ve done
something really incredible. Yes, there’s going to come be, there’s
going to be negative things that are spoken about, or you’re in a rut
where you can’t creatively think.
That’s why you have us in place. have all of the statistics and data
of all the series of every single video you’ve posted. And we can go
back to the first page and say, all right, this is what worked. Let’s
keep trying this. And that whatever you’re feeling right now, you
won’t feel in two weeks. Why? Because we’ve been down this road before
we can do anything and we’re going to keep trying to make it work.
That’s it. Let’s just keep pushing. It’s just a motivating factor.
Speaker 2 (34:41)
Yeah. mean, that constant feedback and that, you know, that
intersection of where the data meets the person is, know, obviously
you, you do something, it performs, you do something else. doesn’t,
there’s that natural propensity to go great. This is the thing about
me people want. So I’m going to keep packaging up this same part of
me. I’m going to keep flexing this one muscle and these other muscles
can kind of go, how do you balance what performs versus what matters?

Yeah. mean, that constant feedback and that, you know, that
intersection of where the data meets the person is, know, obviously
you, you do something, it performs, you do something else. doesn’t,
there’s that natural propensity to go great. This is the thing about
me people want. So I’m going to keep packaging up this same part of
me. I’m going to keep flexing this one muscle and these other muscles
can kind of go, how do you balance what performs versus what matters?
for your clients, you know, and do you have an example maybe of where
resisting the algorithm paid off long term? Yeah, I’d love to know.
Speaker 1 (35:18)
Thousand percent. Yeah. Let me give you a perfect example. Resisting
the algorithm and posting what matters is what Jackson Olson does. So
well, mean, he like hands down, he has taught me and he’s kept me
accountable. We are accountable on both sides of the table is
sometimes we have a really exciting endorsement partnership or brand
deal in front of them where the client wants him to film one thing and
say one thing when in reality he’s the creator, he built this
platform. He knows what will work.
for him and yet not saying that any of that information is
discredited. He wants to post what he knows his audiences is going to
react to 10 times out of 10. We always have to allow our creators to
do so. I will never make anyone or tell anyone, anybody that we
represent or anybody that we’re working with to post anything that
yes, is performative and we have the data that’s going to prove it,
but it’s not my channel. I don’t own it. I will.
At the end of the day, I work, I work for our clients and they need to
be put in the best position for them to succeed. And when there’s, we
try to stay away from like political categories or, or specific
categories that maybe. I have stigmas or both sides react to, but at
end of the day, I’m going to support with what our clients want. And
we, have our own internal values as a company that our clients need to
align with before we bring on talent. if there’s a moment where our
talent needs to speak up.
in a shape or form where this really matters over what we know is
going to create. We support them 100%. And if it means that earnings
will lessen in the future, but they’ll always come in circle back. We
have to do what’s right by the person because this is a human
business. This isn’t a product business and feelings and thoughts and
personality and traits are all part of the content that is created.
Yes, we need to build the business over time, but we also need to do
what’s right for the individual and their personality.
So we’ll just support them in any shape or form.
Speaker 2 (37:16)
Yeah, I think what’s great about that is by helping them build, you
know, their own media presence. What’s lovely about it on a human
level is although yes, on some level you’re, you’re adding two
different shades of pressure and, and, metrics and things that they’re
constantly being judged by. But, know, I worked in talent management
in a very specific ⁓ sector, which was.

Yeah, I think what’s great about that is by helping them build, you
know, their own media presence. What’s lovely about it on a human
level is although yes, on some level you’re, you’re adding two
different shades of pressure and, and, metrics and things that they’re
constantly being judged by. But, know, I worked in talent management
in a very specific ⁓ sector, which was.
advertising directors, know, we had a roster, I, I repped rosters of
directors. would, somebody would be great at comedy. Somebody would be
great at VFX. Somebody would be great at any number of things. And
you’re constantly trying to push them forward, but there always comes
a moment with somebody who either they’re not connecting in the market
or something’s not working and they want to leave. And it’s you, it’s,
you really feel like you’ve let them down, but also the relationship
is based on.
You do this one thing. I get you those opportunities. If I stop, then
I’ve failed. Or if you stop engaging on them, then you’ve failed on
some level. We’ve sort of failed each other. The relationship sort of
goes and it’s hard because, you know, somebody not getting that work
means they’re not paying rent. They’re not, you know, like there are
very real things at the other end of that. What I think is really
lovely about where you’re at is that you’re
Naturally ensuring that there is a hedge against one of the things,
maybe not working, you know, like, you know, okay, you’re either, you
know, with the Poynter brothers, you’re like, well, listen, you’re not
sportsmen, but you know, let’s build this, but you know, let’s get
you, you know, you could be commentators in X many years. If this
takes off and you have enough of a following or whatever else. It’s
you’re naturally in what you’re doing, creating options and options
really.
are the soul’s home of a manager or agent. It’s, you know, you can get
so locked in the job or so locked in the money that you forget that
your real job is options to give your client options for their life,
to make their life better. And it seems like that’s what you’re, you
know, what you’re getting the opportunity to do by, having these,
these two different skill sets being complimentary to one.
Speaker 1 (39:24)
You said it best. the thing is this, it’s a little different from
traditional studio system in Hollywood, actors, actresses, writers,
producers, directors, EPs is this is very much the wild, wild west.
There’s still the system trying to being, you know, formulated of how
the creator economy works, how representation works, how people
create, how money is transacted, how, you know, how value is
transacted amongst multiple different entities. And we just want to
sit at the middle of it all and
From a business standpoint of why I started motive versus why I didn’t
go back to work for anyone else was this is a human business. People
need to be treated properly. People needed to, yes, this isn’t show
friends. This is show business. But at the end of the day,
transactions need to be properly handled and your clients need to feel
supported in the long-term career that they’re about to have. And I’ll
tell you one thing, man, you know it just like I do.

From a business standpoint of why I started motive versus why I didn’t
go back to work for anyone else was this is a human business. People
need to be treated properly. People needed to, yes, this isn’t show
friends. This is show business. But at the end of the day,
transactions need to be properly handled and your clients need to feel
supported in the long-term career that they’re about to have. And I’ll
tell you one thing, man, you know it just like I do.
This is a hyper competitive space. We make one mistake. We, we, we
don’t provide that one option for a client. We’re then exposed for the
client to go find services elsewhere, but we can’t control that. The
only thing that we can control is what we can bring to the table and
how we provide value to our guys and gals. And I think the one thing
that we pride ourselves in is I don’t care about earning money. care
about treating people right. And when you reward people with treating
people right, all of a sudden.
Income seems to appear. And if that is going to be our recipe, it will
never change. Having the rewarding experience of helping another
person grow and thrive in their career will always amount to new
income being driven. And that’s the mantra for our business, man.
That’s
Speaker 2 (41:05)
First of all, I’m really glad that you brought up the Jerry Maguire
quote and it wasn’t me. I thought it would be rude if I brought up
Jerry Maguire, but the fact that you opened that door, I can just walk
through it. But speaking about the, you know, it’s not show friends,
it’s show business, you know, that kind of thing. In terms of your
business model, does it work the same as a traditional manager and
does it work the same across both sides? Cause obviously somebody
who’s doing social media.
Speaker 1 (41:11)
Yup.
Speaker 2 (41:32)
Does it work the same or do you kind of engage with it slightly
differently? How does the business model work, if you don’t mind me
asking?
Speaker 1 (41:38)
Yeah, I would say the business model is very traditional. We don’t
make money unless we make our clients money. And yes, we earn, we earn
revenue based on commission. I would say what is a bit untraditional
and what every agency and management firm I’m sure is growing and
doing now, if they’re not, they’re losing out. would say is our
business is split up into three categories. What I know best is the
traditional talent rep business. I know how to manage my guys. I know
how to grow their business. I know how to grow their business over
time.
And I know how to introduce them to the right people that will harness
new found earnings, content creation, highlights and revenue over
time. The second part of our business is brand consulting and other
type of, you know, campaign management or, or, know, figuring out ways
to add value to advertisers in the space while using the talent
Rolodex we have. We’ve run many campaigns for huge blue chip brands
like Revlon and their Mitcham deodorant. We just launched a huge
campaign where we pretty mad.

And I know how to introduce them to the right people that will harness
new found earnings, content creation, highlights and revenue over
time. The second part of our business is brand consulting and other
type of, you know, campaign management or, or, know, figuring out ways
to add value to advertisers in the space while using the talent
Rolodex we have. We’ve run many campaigns for huge blue chip brands
like Revlon and their Mitcham deodorant. We just launched a huge
campaign where we pretty mad.
Pretty much had every single Savannah bananas player put on a new era
hat. And we ran a whole tick-tock strategy for them in tandem with a
huge release that they had go over the all-star game. That’s our brand
consulting business. That’s a whole new inbound revenue line that
we’re creating based on all the case studies that we’ve taken from our
traditional talent management business, where we’ve been really
working on brand consulting from a one-to-one basis. Now we’re working
on it from a huge volume side.
And then third is where we want to separate ourselves completely.
would say the thing about athletes and creators and now traditional
talent entertaining into this digital realm is we can control
marketing at zero cost. So creating CPG brands or creator led
businesses or services or harnessing new found business that we can
take a portion of motives proceeds year over year and invest yes back
into it.
our clients first come first serve, whether the Poynter brothers
wanted to start a, I think out loud a coffee business and call it
brothers beans or something like that. We will do whatever we can to
make sure that they’re set up for success and introduce them to the
right people so that over time, not only can we participate in that
business with them, but we can also grow it. And then hopefully that
Nestle one day wants to buy brothers beans. That is our huge priority
as a business. We want to have assets.
As a business, we want to utilize the incredible eyeballs, audience,
and conversion data that we can control on the palm of our hand from
the audience we’ve cultivated and then build businesses, 60 around
them. And I think now that we have the right talent, the right people
working with us and the right Rolodex, it’s all coming to place. I
couldn’t be more blessed that that, that, that, is the only way we are
going to operate moving forward is we want to do everything different
from a venture standpoint.
But we also want to keep the tools that are tried and true from the
rep standpoint because it’s worked for so long. And because Hollywood
has worked for so long, if we bring the similar tools and toolkit and
tactics into the creator business, we’ll be able to treat people the
right way.
Speaker 2 (44:47)

Yeah. And now, I mean, let’s talk about sponsorship and marketing as
well as because I think that the way one conceives of it, you know, it
used to be that an athlete was on the field. They performed, they
started getting a name for themselves. The manager then is the one who
is fielding all incoming calls and all outgoing calls to potential
sponsors who are interested in aligning themselves with that athlete.
Now it seems that in the creator economy or the influencer economy or
whatever we call it, the standard operating procedure seems to be
sliding sliding directly. Those brands slide directly in or see chief
marketing officers or chief marketing assistants or whatever slide
directly into the DMS of the athlete. When you’re at that nexus, how
do you even, you know, how do you manage that direct relationship
brands can have with your client versus what your
you know, you’re tracking down and killing yourself. Like what, how
does that work? And is it, does it muddy the waters? Does it just
create more opportunity?
Speaker 1 (45:49)
No, I think, I think the one we’ve been lucky where there’s this thing
in Hollywood called IMDB Pro. Every casting director can go on IMDB
Pro and find who represents that actor. And then they’re going to call
or, uh, if you’re, you worked for a PR agency or an ad agency and you
want to hire a traditional actor, you’re going to go on IMDB Pro
because you know who to call who their representatives are. Now in the
creator business, you’ll start to see different types of emails and
people’s bios on the email button on Instagram. There was a specific
email that you reach out to.
because there hasn’t been any business opportunity that we may or may
not be working on is what is the IMDb pro for the creator economy? But
I would say is how the communication translate translates is how do
get to the talent quickest, fastest, and most productively? I bring up
my buddy who used to run creator marketing at the NHL, guy, Neil
Tennant, who’s just, he’s, he’s amazing. He’s, he’s a superstar. His
biggest struggle was he never knew.
Who that DM was hitting or who that email was actually being received
by. And I think his response rate on outreach from opportunities from
the biggest hockey league in the world and one of the major sports
leagues in America is I think his response rate was like 25%. I mean,
that’s just insane. So what we’ve done to solve that is we have these
motive group email aliases. We always keep every single client in on
those aliases.
But when an email hits, not only do I see it, the client sees it and
anybody else that’s part of the team so that we can handle everything
together. Also, that email is proprietary to each talent individually.
They’re not reaching out to do a deal with Max Fleming. They’re
reaching out to deal to do it, a deal to do with X, and Z. But Max
Fleming’s job is to make sure that we entertain the buyer in a
properly, in a fair and responsive manner.

But when an email hits, not only do I see it, the client sees it and
anybody else that’s part of the team so that we can handle everything
together. Also, that email is proprietary to each talent individually.
They’re not reaching out to do a deal with Max Fleming. They’re
reaching out to deal to do it, a deal to do with X, and Z. But Max
Fleming’s job is to make sure that we entertain the buyer in a
properly, in a fair and responsive manner.
while also educating them, can we do this, that, or what this costs,
when and how, in a totally timely fashion. Orlando, I’d say, I’d say,
⁓ 60 % of our business is inbound like that, but 40 % of our business
is we will do everything in our power to hustle, grind, and find the
new opportunities and get to those people before they feel the need to
reach out. Because the rewarding experience of bringing an opportunity
or an option to a client before they saw it hit their inbox is what
keeps us.
motivatedness, kind of that pilot light under our ass. But sometimes
the, the, the, the buyer is just trying to get in touch and get a deal
done. Problem is they never know who’s, who’s behind that email or, or
if it’s actually the player or the person. So we’ve, we’ve tried to
solve that on our end and until IMDB pro for creators has been created
by hopefully Orlando and Max Fleming, would say, uh, that, that is,
uh, that’s the current state of the business for sure.
Yeah, great question. And that’s the reason I started motive. If
motive becomes a business that’s similar to anywhere I’ve worked prior
or anyone anywhere that we competed with, I didn’t do it right on the
flip side to that. 90 % of our entrepreneurs that copy businesses are
often successful because the business has been done prior. So taking
notes from how others have done it and implemented into our business
will mean we can actually do it. Well,
The only way we want to run motive is, is how we want to run it. And
what we’re going to do to change that is the following. We are going
to completely operate like teammates, not like stock tickers and
evaluate each talent based on if they’re performing or not. And if
they’re not performing, we will not offload our talent. We will get in
the weeds. And if we have to disrupt our earnings or our revenues,
it’s because we need to take the time to re-strategize the people that
we believe in because we don’t take a client on.
Unless we’re willing to put the hours, the efforts and the sweat into
each person individually, no matter where they are in their career,
whether they’re as huge as the Poynter brothers, hugest Jackson or a
developmental client that’s about to make their strides. Everyone
deserves our time equally. And yes, others have more going on, but the
time in which I break down for each client is based on what they have
going on today and what they have going on in the future based on how
we get there. And second to that.
how we are going to be different is, but actually I’m going to go, I’m
going to backtrack. The goal for the next five years to answer the
first part of your question is as a serial entrepreneur, man, I am
obsessed with investing in other businesses and creating, and I just
have a notebook filled with ideas from top to bottom. I’ll have 10
ideas that I come about today. 10 of them are absolutely going to be
ridiculous, but I’m of the belief any idea is a good idea until we
find the one that works. So the next five years.

how we are going to be different is, but actually I’m going to go, I’m
going to backtrack. The goal for the next five years to answer the
first part of your question is as a serial entrepreneur, man, I am
obsessed with investing in other businesses and creating, and I just
have a notebook filled with ideas from top to bottom. I’ll have 10
ideas that I come about today. 10 of them are absolutely going to be
ridiculous, but I’m of the belief any idea is a good idea until we
find the one that works. So the next five years.
I’m going to put all my blood, sweat and tears into motive to make
sure that it can operate very, very well. But at the same time,
figuring out ways where I can have like, listen, successes in the
agency of others. So others to help run motive in which motive can
survive without me, my clients and my network. So that it’s ever
flowing business, but the same time, the next five years, how we’re
going to operate differently is we’re going to expose all of our
clients, the opportunities of.
Yes. Earning brand endorsements. Yes. Entertaining Hollywood TV and
film opportunities. Yes. Podcast this out of the other thing, any type
of medium while also participate in maybe retainer rounds. I would
love to get the Poynter brothers on a call with who knows Goldman
Sachs about why they need to be investing in this type of business.
And I’ll tell you one thing, if we have the talent that can help run
the brand consulting in there with us, rather than another person
that’s trying to sell them something me.
We are going to win more conversations and then they get to
participate in a whole different type of earning potential. Third, I
want all of our clients to be not only investing in other CPG or other
business types, but it’s mandatory that all of our clients are
participating in philanthropic and community-based and volunteer work
and doing this type of different things. We are not a management
company. We are not an agency. We are not any type of infrastructure.
Motive is a community.
And how we’re going to do it differently is where all of our clients
are going to work together to succeed. That’s it. That’s number one.
Yeah. Build a purpose is be authentically you at end of the day, you
know, you, you can’t really predict whether it’s going to, you’re
going to go mega viral or you’re not. I would just say we, we, we live
by three, the three words CCR community consistency and relatability.
And if you’re authentically you and you keep driving it day in and day
out, and it becomes so boring, but that you continue to do the boring
things that purpose will drive you through.
And fighting through the imposter syndrome of, ⁓ I’m afraid to post
this video because my friends are going to think I’m weird for doing
so. Your friends are going to have their hand out like this. When you
have 5 million followers across all your channels and every brand on
the planet wants to work with you. I would say if you want it bad
enough and you want to fight through any type of imposter syndrome,
follow community consistency and relatability. But

And fighting through the imposter syndrome of, ⁓ I’m afraid to post
this video because my friends are going to think I’m weird for doing
so. Your friends are going to have their hand out like this. When you
have 5 million followers across all your channels and every brand on
the planet wants to work with you. I would say if you want it bad
enough and you want to fight through any type of imposter syndrome,
follow community consistency and relatability. But
be authentically you and just keep pushing. You just gotta keep going.
That’s it. And it may work out or it may not work out, but you just
gotta keep trying.
Speaker 2 (53:16)
And what stage does somebody, so somebody’s building, somebody’s
either an athlete growing through their community is growing, whatever
else. At what stage do you feel that they’re most apt to call you? At
what stage do they go, okay, I’m at a level now. I think I should call
Max.
Speaker 1 (53:35)
Yeah, I think, I think we’ll entertain any conversation. think it’s
all about time to productivity bandwidth for me. Remember I do not
have the bandwidth in the world to represent everyone, but when to
call me is if you have a question on stuck in this creative run, I’ve
been posting every single day for the last three months and nothing
has improved. Great. We’re going to provide you with those quick
strategies, whether we represent you or not. And then I would say from
a bandwidth standpoint of where we are is motive is going to keep
hiring really great people. We’re going to continue to keep.
training and educating all the managers, the coordinators, everybody
that’s going to be a part of the business to have the same, we are
going to operate like one unit, the same message that I’ll provide
because we’re all going to be operating in unison. then I think how we
evaluate bringing on talent is not only do they want it as bad as we
want it for them, and not only do they want to work with us for their
30, 35 plus year career.
If they really want to do this and say they have 30,000 followers on
Instagram, it’s never about the following for me. So they have 5
million. It’s always about looking in the data based on an engagement
standpoint, because they built their audience. We will entertain any
conversation based on people that have the ability to communicate to
people through digital lunges on TikTok, Snapchat, Facebook, IG, yada,
yada, yada. And that want to take that audience off platform to build
something greater.
Why at the end of the day, do you really own the audience that you
have on Instagram or does it, or does Meta own it? What happens if
Meta pulls your account away? You have no control over that. What can
we do to use the platforms that are in place for us now to build an
audience, have a voice, build a personal brand, then take all three of
those things off platform over time to build businesses. And that’s
who we work with, whether they have zero followers or not. We are a, a
management company, you know, we’re here to, we’re here to build those
careers.

Speaker 2 (55:33)
Max Fleming, thank you so much for this. I knew this was going to be a
good one and I knew I was going to learn a lot and all of that has
come true. This was really terrific. Thank you for taking the time. I
think what you’re doing is great. You seem to have just such a lovely
human centric attitude towards the whole thing. And I think that
that’s, that really comes across very well. And I think, I think I
really wish you all the
best of luck with it because it’s you know you’re you’re already doing
brilliantly but but i think there’s there’s green pastures ahead
Speaker 1 (56:03)
I appreciate it. Thank you for having me on and call me about that. I
am DB for creators right after the I will.
Speaker 2 (56:08)
for
sure. I wrote it down right here.
Speaker 1 (56:11)
Hell yeah. Awesome, guys.
Speaker 2 (56:13)
Thank you so much.